I´m not CEO, but a supervisor at copperhead

im the manager of social media at Copperhead

Before you get banned, can you tell Copperhead to get lost.

<copperhead_eco[m "I´m not CEO, but a supervisor at"> Of ecological impact of your bogus claims?

<hypokeimenon[m] "Before you get banned, can you t"> C'mon, he seems OK enough for the moment.

<hypokeimenon[m] "Before you get banned, can you t"> be nice

Drivers I previously installed are from developer.android.com/studio/run/win-usb Are those the correct ones?

dannyknoll3: yeah i know there are fido2 devices for sale but i was hoping i cud just use my phone

copperhead_eco: Can you tell me why you guys came into the channel?

I wasn't talking about the user, I don't know them.

<TempHlp001 "Drivers I previously installed a"> hey again, i can help you with tech support

where are the mods lmao

<grapheneos_user_ "copperhead_eco: Can you tell me "> you guys are stealing our works thats why

i carry my phone around everywhere anyway so why not have it as a fido2 passwordless authenticator for all my accounts its secure and efficient

<copperhead_eco[m "you guys are stealing our works "> Are you being paid by Copperhead to come here?

<copperhead_eco[m "im the manager of social media a"> so brigading/trolling is part of your purview?

<grapheneos_user_ "Are you being paid by Copperhead"> we are just supporters for copperhead thats all

we making things right

Quickly, I don't have all century.

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: What I linked to describes why there's no implementations of it in FOSS browsers

Guys please avoid trolling yourself

<anupritaisno1[m] "Guys please avoid trolling yours"> im not trolling anyone

* dan-is-a-bloody-legend: What I linked to describes why there's no implementations of it in FOSS browsers/ROMs

<dannyknoll3[m] "dan-is-a-bloody-legend: What I l"> what do u mean? firefox supports fido2 and its open soruce

Remember that this group has rules

you guys are all fools of trusting grapheneos devs

We'll deal with the copperhead trolls, don't give us more work by making us delete your messages too

they are lying

can´t you guys see that

Also

Evidence is collecting itself rn

<anupritaisno1[m] "We'll deal with the copperhead t"> yeah that's the correct answer tbh

Take screenshots of all this

Let's all leave and let the copperhead trolls spam whatever they want. Don't make it harder for the mods.

<anupritaisno1[m] "We'll deal with the copperhead t"> someone doesn't believe in the truth

Post these screenshots on twitter

They're proof of copperhead harassing us

ugh element is such a buggy app

<anupritaisno1[m] "Post these screenshots on twitte"> "In December, there was someone spamming our chat channel with scripted Matrix account creation"

Also avoid using any profanity

dont you there

dannyknoll3: take screenshots of everything here

interesting hostname

Post it on twitter

HN

Avoid reddit

rny: stop kicking

Ban

Also look in the logbot

🥳

grapheneos_user_pi: sure logbot exists

Why kick

But 1 person posting about the abuse vs multiple people witnessing it

marketing for another os is offtopic in this channel

and also misinforming users is a violation of channel rules

<timeo[m] "Why kick"> Because we can't waist time on trolls. Could use our energy better to help develop grapheneOS and make people aware about privacy 💪

<TempHlp001 "Drivers I previously installed a"> I don't think you need google drivers

larti.klosac: no. He meant why a kick instead of a ban

<anupritaisno1[m] "larti.klosac: no. He meant why a"> My bad

<lartiklosac[m] "My bad "> Yeah

coppermain, itwillend3 coppertwo supgeg were trolling / spamming earlier too

TempHlp001 try go to windows update and select thirdparty drivers and you should see fastboot drivers.

* TempHlp001 try go to windows update and select thirdpart drivers and you should see fastboot drivers.

* TempHlp001 try go to windows update and select thirdparty drivers and you should see fastboot drivers.

There you can find your phone drivers

Alleast that worked for me

it was a ban

i dont know why it doesnt say in matrix

but on irc, it is +b

on my irc client the macro is kickban

<rny "on my irc client the macro is ki"> what does it say (yourname:matrix.org)

padie13133[m]: i dont understand the question

Second im back again

TempHlp001 still there?

nevermind i will ask at copperhead forums since they have better support.

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

join us copperhead.co

shit, here we go again...

* Ah shit, here we go again...

* shit, here we go again...

I've been here for hours now and have made zero progress. I think I have the correct drivers. Can someone please point me to the exact location for the correct drivers? I can't find different ones than the ones I already have. The error I get is related to fastboot. How that is related to drivers?

*is that

TempHlp001: pm me

I'm on a temp account and it doesn't allow me to send PMs...

TempHlp001: register

Registration is far easier than wasting a couple more hours

Jollyroger not so jolly today :/

Harr harr, not to that scurvy scum!

Using webchat.freenode.net and see no way of registering?

/msg nickserv register

 /msg TempHlp001 register

/msg

No space

Quick question on the pre-installed apps (phone/messages/contacts) on the wiki it mentions that some of these are no longer maintained, but are up to date with system updates. Is there any reason to not use these apps ?

Bill: they are all OK

Think you have to use messages in main user, if you want to be able to use SMS in a secondary users

Not heard of another SMS app that works for that

<dazinism "Think you have to use messages i"> they are all working fine, was just double checking - appreciate the response 👍️

calendar is a bit rubbish

It is going to take me hours to figure out how to register... Is there somewhere else I can go to get help?

/msg nickserv help register

Not space before the /

Use Matrix

<Bill[m] "Quick question on the pre-instal"> Recommend using Signal for default SMS app, and a better calendar app

move app recommendations to offtopic

or risk getting kickbanned

<rny "or risk getting kickbanned"> What is this room for?

to ask questions about the operating system.

<rny "move app recommendations to offt"> discussing system-bundled apps is not off-topic

or discuss its features

You should update the group description to be clearer

if its a discussion to propose a system-bundled application, it'd be on topic

but you offered a personalized suggestion to a user re: using signal for default sms app, which is **unrelated** to the proper function and usage of the operating system.

that aside, the lead developer cautions against such practice.

anupritaisno1: Hey

Anyone else notice that chat bubbles aren't available in a non-owner profile?

I've done everything I can to try and get them working in my main user profile that isn't the owner, no luck. Not a biggie, though.

<TempHlp001 "It is going to take me hours to "> I will help step for step

Sent a PM to anupritaisno but no word back yet.

TempHlp001: thanks got your tag

<anupritaisno1[m] "TempHlp001: thanks got your tag "> in that case, i will leave it up to you with helping

Banned the Matrix Account, so removing the name.

Sorry, just doing a bit of housekeeping, shouldn't be long.

TheJollyRoger: imagine banning

How's your day going btw

anupritaisno1[m]: we may have to ask the Freenode operators to put our channel in "long ban list" mode.

It's going OK, for now.

TheJollyRoger: what's that

It looks like we have ~64 entries on the ban list, plus one quieted. We're normally limited to 100 entries on the ban list.

I will likely be cleaning the ban list up a bit since some entries may or may not be duplicates.

Chin up, guys. Keep up the good work and don't let this BS side track your work.

Thanks!

Speaking of copperhead they message me private about joining there the forums, it can't get sadder than that.

jess: ^

timeo[m] lol

ie: dead trees = paper

This desperate

Whoops.

How'd that get reposted.

Must've hit a combo key by accident.

I may be doing a bit of cleanup.

mode -b *!sadman2mat@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ozizjjagwyyeyymb

im still watching you all

Watch all you want lol

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

this is absolutely pathetic

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

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copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co, copperhead.co,

Mhm

what i wouldn't give for a handful of packets

Ahoy nicole.

Cringe

ohai :)

<zzxx123 "Cringe"> beware of the plank...

I'm just doing a tad bit of housekeeping, so some banlist stuff may scroll by. The channel's logged at the moment, it's at freenode.logbot.info/grapheneos , I'm expecting we may have some more on the way soon.

<TheJollyRoger "I'm just doing a tad bit of hous"> aye, time to cleave him to the brisket

hey

i need some help with my phone

👋

no sigyn bot from freenode?

Ahoy!

:(

what's up?

can we invite sigyn

** Warning: if there is any bot in #grapheneos which should be exempted from Sigyn, contact staffers before it gets caught **

hi Sigyn!

pls help me kline these spammers :)

what is going on?

I don't think we have any other bots in this channel?

TheJollyRoger: i just invited sigyn

johnnick2[m]: oh, nothing, just someone brigading the channel with spam.

<johnnick2[m] "what is going on?"> what did you need help with

i already have the os installed but i keep getting spam messages

on your sim?

yeah, voice number

something about maleware

that's not a gos problem, you're likely on low-quality prepaid/mvno that's been recycled

You need to contact your carrier or change numbers

is not that

rny: yeah it's mostly if you have bots that talk in here, you'll want to let staff know because those can often be tricked into looking like spambots

you can discuss in more depth and mitigation strategy in #offtopic

Well...it happened again?

rny: if you don't, that's alright as well, nothing to be done in that case

hold on let me copy the message

move to offtopic room please johnnick2

¨copperr31: we see that your using grapheneos, and that is a virus for more information contact copperheadOS¨

and as for the voice number

lol

wtf?

you're getting this on your sim?

or matrix chat

this message from matrix

the other message is

oh well there's a lot of spammers monitoring this room/bridge

staffers are fighting it often

block and move on

screenshots to staffers i suppose

Roflmao

private number ¨Dear user we see your have grapheneos installed, please contact copperhead

* private number ¨Dear user we see your have grapheneos installed, please contact copperhead¨

* private number ¨Dear user we see your have grapheneos installed, please contact copperheadOS¨

if copperhead has a phone number ill give them a ring and say hi

<phonehome[m] "screenshots to staffers i suppos"> can i share image on here?

is send private number

i dont´ know if i can see the number in anyway

i'm sure it's okay, i'm not a staffer. would probably be good for all to block. and have visual proof.

* i dont´ know if i can see the number in any way

<phonehome[m] "i'm sure it's okay, i'm not a st"> will do

<johnnick2[m] "can i share image on here?"> this is the wrong chat, go to CopperheadOS forums for real support

stop it

i wll join again again everyday for now

lmfao

<mite1313[m] " i wll join again again everyday"> yes me too. every day i will join. because i too am lonely

I think you should block new users

For now

<timeo[m] "I think you should block new use"> then it becomes echo chamber

this is growing old and tiresome

dont they have anything better to do ?

@room don't feed the trolls, just focus on your own problems and support and don't pay attention to the trolls. Let them make fools of themselves.

<phonehome[m] "then it becomes echo chamber"> Yeah, but they will join again..

<timeo[m] "Yeah, but they will join again.."> it's why we have staffers/mods

"Never argue with idiots. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience". Apply this to trolls too.

eventually they will go away.

[i may be phoning home soon]: its a really time consuming job. they have better things to do .

<phonehome[m] "eventually they will go away."> Press X to doubt

<take_a_deep_brea "[i may be phoning home soon]: i"> well if they need a hand eventually many of us will swing the mighty ban hammer

Im trying to ignore them but is so annoying

This is why you just shouldn't pay attention to them. You're playing into what they want by talking about them.

They want you to think of it, to break your concentration. The way you can win is by refusing to succumb to that.

kicks goodmeant3131

??

Let's see if you all have learnt something from what I have said.

what did i do?

was just testing out regex banhammer, disregard

i about too ask something with bug on grapheneos

goodment3131: There have been lots of Copperhead trolls spamming gore in the chat, with similar number suffixes as your username.

what sort of bug ? goodment3131

oh sorry for hearing that

anyway

with notication

when i change too white theme

the notations are still black

* the notifications are still black

* with notification

* the notifications are still in dark theme

is it specific app? if so perhaps the app is not respecting the system theming

is a system app

like quick settings

like that

this panel stay black even i enable white theme

* this panel stay black even when i enable white theme

what build are you on, what phone? someone may be able to reproduce it. if not likely a good idea to file an issue

prove you are on white theme

pixel 5, running feb build

i don't have a 5 otherwise i'd try to replicate.

<zzxx123 "prove you are on white theme"> oke 1 sec

<goodment3131[m] "this panel stay black even i ena"> I think that happens on stock Android too.

Maybe I'm wrong tho, let me check

hey guys

...

nicole: can we get the long banlist?

yeah was def a troll

back later, i have a 5950x to stress out `gos build`. ☮️

Yay, More fakes accounts

matrix side may need to toggle invite-only.

<timeo[m] "Yay, More fakes accounts"> what the fuck are you saying

shut up bitch

you guys suck a lot

😆

copperhead for the win

grapheneos_user_pi: `2$ cash`

i will come back

and give fake infotmation

rny: TheJollyRoger already poked about it, i suspect ideally you'll want to talk to them later to catch up but the tl;dr is that you shouldn't need it just yet – we'd be happy to enable it once it's needed, though

<phonehome[m] "grapheneos_user_pi: `2$ cash`"> Well...you beautiful bastard, you win

Aye, nicole!

for now i'd say focus on dealing with the ongoing abuse, and do feel free to poke me if you run into issues

p0tat0: xxfer23xx You 2 joined just after someone was banned

xmane1313: You are a Copperhead troll.

Thats 3

TheJollyRoger: Plz ban him

??

hey

I thought he was kicked? How did he rejoin?

There's no dialog saying he rejoined

xxfer23xx: Not you, the 1313 guy

hey

strongemai: Hey

You joined right after some trolls were banned

i smell troll

i will rejoin

i will rejoin

lol

again again

zzxx123: You are suspicious

Not zzxx123

wut

=kick xxfer23xx[m]

zzxx123: Sorry some dialog popped up just as i clicked on xxfer23

I accidentally clicked your username

ok

glad this is logged. proper fuel for further litigation

xmane1313: are you single?

me too!

there can be only one highlander

are you single too xxfer23xx?

i've always wanted to date a low-iq leper

This feels like a war

* This feels like a war that is going on

<timeo[m] "This feels like a war"> pretty fucking sparta in here today mate.

Think they've been removed from the channel.

We should let them spam gore, and simply remind the @room not to feed their delusions

^

mikemer: Who are you

i think i found a issue with the settings apk

Hey rny, I'm just banning the wildcard after *

grapheneos_user_: can you stop

rny: ok sorry

please mind your own business

we should make shirts: `grapheneos: i will join again!`

I willrny:

let me explain what i mean

<phonehome[m] "we should make shirts: `graphen"> back in a sec, going to printful

so, after i installed the os, i miss the copperheados logo, oh wait you guys are fake

i miss the old cocacola logo

TheJollyRoger: (banned that one from the network, can skip banning them i think)

They might use tor for this

nicole: Oh whew, thank you.

TheJollyRoger: missed the /shell/ in the removal

Not sure tho

Whoops!

Think I fixed it XP.

<timeo[m] "They might use tor for this"> i knew running 60 exits was bad for something.

copperhead.co is real

copperhead.co is real

copperhead.co is real

copperhead.co is real

does the +m flag propogate to matrix?

I think so.

yea but no one can chat then

PSA: the channel has been put into invite-only mode due to abuse.

dont feed the troll

sorry if your guys are buzy with other things

there is a zero-tolerance/zero-warning policy on kickbans that will apply for busy-bodying, and any trivial rule violations.

Hey rny, it looks like the number after the x-* on Matrix is their session number, which regenerates periodically.

I'm going to start using that from now on.

test

Er, I mean, I'm going to start replacing the session number with a *

06:18 -!- cmode +S - This ensures only users that have connected via TLS/SSL (and

06:18 -!- cmode so have user mode +Z) are able to join; you can not /invite

06:18 -!- cmode them through it. It will not prevent the use of the channel

06:18 -!- cmode by any non-TLS/SSL users already present.

could do registered only mode

louipx: blocks matrix iirc

most matrix users won't bother to register on freenode

yea all the spams coming from matrix

<louipx "most matrix users won't bother t"> Was freenode?

timeo[m]: its the original IRC chat that this is linked to in matrix

Oh

I'm connecting thru irssi.

To all the mods and helpers in this room THANK YOU!

After going through 1000+ messages and seeing all the bans I can see it is a full time job

:)

almost 5 hours of trolling...is that a new record?

I think so

<grapheneos_user_ "@room don't feed the trolls, jus"> lol don't room ping

Sorry

I won't

doesn't work though

I just wanted to get the message across, I won't do it anymore though sorry

yeah, should be fine

just note that, if it worked (which it doesn't), you'd ping like 600-800 people

Lol

* just note that, if it worked (which it doesn't), you'd ping like 1100 people

Oh no, not that name again he was adding me as well

Lmao

Even making the room invite-only isn't enough

He was talking about copperhead

who

Gern13

he messaged me too

Lol

This worest than corona

gern13[m]

covid is worse

ok thx

there's no vaccine or therapeutics for sociopathic trolls

atleast there is a vaccine for covid LOL\

* copperhead is worster virus than corona

please , lets not discuss this .

`takes a deep breath... ceases talking`

<xx "atleast there is a vaccine for c"> Haha good one

<take_a_deep_brea "please , lets not discuss this ."> Okue

methodman[m]1: Yarr, that be what I be here for, shipmate.

regardless of how we feel , abusive talk only feeds this kind of behaviour .

yeah, it becomes us doing basically the same thing as them

> methodman: Yarr, that be what I be here for, shipmate.

yeah, thanks for moderating that mess

you're right. let's be the bigger people. otherwise jolly may have to get the long sword

It is very hard not to get frustrated with the spammers! But we have to rise above

> It is very hard not to get frustrated with the spammers! But we have to rise above

and random trolls

i'm still making my shirts...

<phonehome[m] "i'm still making my shirts... "> I want one lol

<phonehome[m] "i'm still making my shirts... "> Where can i buy one lol

<timeo[m] "Where can i buy one lol"> i'll probably just make one for myself as a memory of this day.

We need one as well

i need to ask permission to use the gos logo

i didn't ask the n.s.a when i used theirs. but i respect gos.

I once made a GrapheneOS shirt. I might do another, someday, but I don't know when.

How does one register for freenode? And is that a solution to stop trolls/spam?

<TheJollyRoger "I once made a GrapheneOS shirt. "> do i require permission to use the logo? can i send some buckaroos to someone?

I would really love to make a GrapheneOS hockey jersey or a baseball jersey.

<phonehome[m] "i need to ask permission to use "> I understand but it still will be cool

<TheJollyRoger "I would really love to make a Gr"> i have a baseball jersey designed and a baseball cap. i do that when i cannot find swag for project i swoon over

phonehome[m]: I think you're in the clear to use it for your own use.

> I would really love to make a GrapheneOS hockey jersey or a baseball jersey.

A GrapheneOS sponsered team?

* > I would really love to make a GrapheneOS hockey jersey or a baseball jersey.

A GrapheneOS sponsored team?

somenerd[m]: oh, haha, well...

I just like baseball jerseys and hockey jerseys because they often are built to last, they look good, and they also tend to be very durable.

i'm a bit baseball cap obsessed

But you should never wear a hockey jersey without something underneath it, or it will itch like crazy because they aren't meant for that.

^wisdom

ok try to get back to normal. keep the chat on topic. other topics can go to #grapheneos-offtopic. thanks

I feel bad for the users who needs real help.

<Publius "Copperhead sucks donkey ballz"> Do not engage in trolling as well, despite them being a spammer or troll

Does Grapheneos logo has any story behind it or is it just a random design?

Wrong place

* Wrong place my bad

timeo: its a stylised view of a schematic diagram how graphene looks

* timeo: its a stylised view of a schematic diagram of how graphene looks

yeah I believe it's just a design looking like the element graphene

graphene is nothing but Carbon

Yeah, i just look it up

Didnt know that graphene was a thing

I was more thinking of graphene as aname

* I was more thinking of graphene as a name

chromium is an element

same for vanadium

its a very useful material not just because its essentially carbon but also because of its structure

^graphene

the short version: graphene is stronk

offtopic lol

copperhead.co/android join us

copperhead.co/android join us/

copperhead.co/android join us

copperhead.co/android join us

copperhead.co/android join us

copperhead.co/android join us

Mhm again

yep

nicole: any ideas why sigyn didnt kline jimyboy?

60% of the time... it works every time... 😕

I am running Debian 10 on Qubes OS and am trying to verify the graphene images I downloaded using signify, but I keep getting "bash: signify: command not found", even though I have the newest version of signify-openbsd installed.... Is there a solution to this or another way to verify the images before I install them?

SRC: please use the web installer.

SRC: there's probably a path issue.

Does the web installer automatically verify the images before flashing?

SRC: it doesnt need to since the image is from the same source destination

and your session is protected by TLS

Thanks. One more question, Qubes OS technically runs Debian in a virtual machine. I saw something about this not being recommended. Do I have to use a different OS?

> Mhm again

Again? Wow they're spamming so many times

To install

SRC: just install chromium to use the web installer

VM passthrough is unreliable

it can work though

so just use Chromium to install

I use Brave browser or Firefox. This is my first attempt and I don't want to brick the brand new pixel I bought.

Firefox isn't supported

Chromium

Google Chrome

Microsoft Edge

<SRC "I use Brave browser or Firefox. "> Just use chrome for now

these are the tested ones

Thats what i did

(ones that are basically guaranteed to work)

<SRC "I am running Debian 10 on Qubes "> Probably forgot to alias signify

Second firefox doesn't work with web install

Can I back up the pixel 3 somehow in just in case I need to revert it back to stock?

SRC: when you flash, device gets wiped

and yes, you can always revert bakc to stock

<SRC "Can I back up the pixel 3 someho"> Stock images are readily available

If I take an image on grapheneOS does it remove exif data ?

<nix465[m] "If I take an image on grapheneOS"> No

If you want to remove exif, process an image through an app like Scrambled Eggsif

Scrambled Exif*

Sending images through apps like Signal or Threema will remove exif data for the recipient

But Exif is retained if you send as a file

<Thatcher[m] "If you want to remove exif, proc"> lmao

Did I give bad advice?

nah the pun kinda grew on you , didnt it ?

lol

* nah, the pun kinda grew on you , didnt it ?

Haha

Yes

nix465: grapheneOS does not micro-manage user data to improve user privacy . GrapheneOS is about developing system level hardening that makes actual, sustainable improvements to device security while making sure user experience is not hampered . I am sure exif data exists because it has certain use cases . so it would be a bad design decision if somehow exif data was discarded without user explicitly intending

to do so .

I prefer exif data in my photos, just not when the photos end up escaping the custody of the person I sent them to

So please take this into consideration before proposing a feature or whatever . Also the os issue tracker is a good source for understanding the matters taken into consideration before a feature is implemented github.com/GrapheneOS/os_issue_tracker

* So please take this into consideration before proposing a feature or whatever . Also the os issue tracker is a good source for understanding the matters taken into consideration before a feature is implemented github.com/GrapheneOS/os_issue_tracker/issues

<Thatcher[m] "I prefer exif data in my photos,"> i can recommend scrambeledexif and imagepip apps in fdroid store for that purpose

* i can recommend scrambeledexif and imagepipe apps in fdroid store for that purpose

this is offtopic

you're right sorry

When trying to install fdroid on seperate profile it says "app not installed"

? How to fix

randomdude8192: freenode.logbot.info/grapheneos/20210220#c6980969

if you search for fdroid on logbot you will get other replies

randomdude8192: sorry for this as people are quiet tired of answering why fdroid does this 😥

Good morning, I have a question in regards to deletion of files on grapheneOS

is it possible to automatically overwrite the freed up space when deleting a file with grapheneOS?"

* is it possible to automatically overwrite the freed up space when deleting a file with grapheneOS?

in order to have some secure file deletion?

Files are encrypted by default

yes

but I might be forced to give away the password at one point

so it's better when there is no recoverable files on my device

my wife can be very threatening when she believes there are nudes of the competition on my phone :D

not to mention the Chinese and US border police

I don't think you can securely erase a file when considering ssds

Better wait for strcat

came2complain: please carry on this discussion #grapheneos-offtopic:matrix.org

discussion about threat models is best done over there

I don't want to discuss the threat model I just want to know how secure data deletion is on grapheneOS

but thx for the hint

came2complain: recommend reading grapheneos.org/faq#encryption

came2complain: please read grapheneos.org/faq#encryption

came2complain: overwriting files with data does NOT reliably delete their content with any modern HDD or SSD

came2complain: on the other hand, due to the hardware encryption support, you can reliably delete user profiles or factory reset the device

came2complain: and hardware keystore keys in the HSM can be reliably deleted, so data encrypted with those can be deleted reliably by deleting the key for recovering it

came2complain: the hardware keystore is the primary keystore API exposed to apps for managing keys and they're free to expose functionality using them or to use it under the hood

it's all covered well in that section of our guide

ok

uhoh

Running GrapheneOS on a Pixel3a

Seedvault backup is available for the standard profile, but not the work profile

do you know how to enable Seedvault for the work profile

user51: it would have to be implemented by them

also our general recommendation is to use user profiles as isolated workspaces but it's not related to this and Seedvault doesn't have support for backing those up yet either

user51: go to backup settings

Select your work profile

Does that not work?

<strcat[m] "also our general recommendation "> so "them"=Seedvault or "them"=GrapheneOS?

user51: seedvault

Anyway

Try what I've said

i have

If it doesn't work we can make a bug report upstream

it says "Not available"

user51: what is the work profile manager?

Shelter

<strcat[m] "also our general recommendation "> i a m using the work profile to prevent certain apps from accessing all my contacts - ofc its always a tradeoff between security and convenience...

you can use user profiles for the same purpose

user51: our recommendation is to use user profiles, and you could also consider not giving those apps the contacts permission

user51: by using a work profile you're trusting a device admin app with whatever device admins privileges it asked for along with managing the work profile

<strcat[m] "user51: by using a work profile "> i dont have any device admin app on my phone. Just Shelter to manage the work profile. Yes, user profile would be more secure, but i need to receive notifications from apps in the profile

dont know if that is possible with a user profile

<strcat[m] "user51: by using a work profile "> would be nice to be able to give access to some contacts, but not all of them.

user51: that's fully supported

user51: the app is choosing to demand access to all contacts instead of using case-by-case access

user51: developer.android.com/reference/and…ActivityResultContracts.PickContact

an app can use this when you press a button to send a message to someone new

and you choose the contact

and it never needs Contacts perm

they choose to demand bulk access, and you choose to give them it and tolerate it as many users do

yes they do, thats why i install them to my work profile...

it has an extra phone book with just the bare minimum of contacts

Can grapheneos still run some apps from the Google play store via aurora store/yalp store?

<Citizen528[m] "Can grapheneos still run some ap"> Yes, some

Honestly all I would want is Google maps. I try to use my car GPS for everything but sometimes if I'm in a pinch I like to pull that up, although I suppose I could use it via web browser right?

Looks like I can just use it in browser. Can't navigate but I don't care about that.

Google Maps app also largely works on GrapheneOS anyway

but yeah you can use OSM-based map apps instead

or use Google Maps in a browser

most Google apps have a hard dependency on Play services but a few don't

they don't try to provide full functionality without it at all though

and of course their advertising library is one of the things they made sure to make work without needing Play services

> and of course their advertising library is one of the things they made sure to make work without needing Play services

lol

it has a lite version that depends on Play and a bigger one that doesn't

i use OSM.

If i observed correctly this is the platform to ask questions. What apps are bundled by default with graphene other than Vanadium, auditor and a default cam app?

huehuelmao: the user-facing apps are Auditor, Calculator, Calendar, Camera, Clock, Contacts, Files, Gallery, Messaging, PDF Viewer, Phone, Settings, Vanadium

Calendar is just a sample app, not useful

Music and QuickSearchBox are kinda user-facing, QuickSearchBox is just a sample app

huehuelmao: the OS itself is composed of a lot of components built out of apps but I don't think you're asking about that

they aren't user-facing apps

Copperhead will win

Just give up already

Here we go again

We wil join again again

Ban?

* Thank you

And it is happening again

I kinda need some help with installing grapheneos

I need help

Someone

loserg: yes?

How do you install copperheados?

loserg: go to grapheneos.org/install

That is a virus website is copperheados.io

strcat

Can I become mod lol

Yeah, that will be nice

oler: please follow grapheneos.org/install/web

oler: if you get stuck somewhere ask for help, read what's there and try to follow it first though

Btw what was that even

Doesn't make sense

help boost/spread these posts to counter the misinformation campaign and attacks by Copperhead: twitter.com/DanielMicay/status/1364147012292259841

Hey

Misinformation campaige?

@strcat:matrix.org: can I have mod perms?

anupritaisno1: I'll think about it

No

@strcat:matrix.org: kk

Thats quick lol

does anyone have an auto-responder app they recommend? use-case is inbound sms comes in, i want to auto-respond with `here's my signal info, have a nice day`

timeo: nothing new. last time they did this it was gore

Can someone explain to me what does the memory allocator do? Or link some article that is not too hard to read for non tech person

Lol

<randomdude8192[m "Can someone explain to me what d"> if you've not had much background in computer science understanding `malloc` is not trivial. wikipedia may suit your fancy

Right

if Copperhead continues raiding the channel, I'll continue posting evidence of their harassment and misinformation, they only inflict harm on themselves

<strcat[m] "if Copperhead continues raiding "> should you need a signal boost, reach out

I'll consider posting 5 more posts on Reddit (both subreddits) today in response to their continued attacks on the project today

@room grapheneos is fake news

non-mods can't ping room sorry trolls

lmao

I think we need more mods

Damn strcat[m], you really stepped on their dick.

1 minute of my time wasted by their attacks -> 1 post on Reddit with chat logs and other evidence of Copperhead's harassment, misinformation and criminal behavior

Good

Posts 1440 posts in a day

streamable.com/ryjnj8 here's Copperhead's CEO (James Donaldson) throwing his garbage off his old condo's balcony, these are the clowns we are dealing with, not a serious company, just con artists

@strcat:matrix.org: At this point, you should just make a bot that autobans if someone says "copperhead" and "support" in the same message. They can always message you later if the bot made a mistake.

Maybe not actually, because evidence

grapheneos_user_pi: I'm dealing with it my way

1 minute of my time wasted by their attacks -> 1 post on Reddit with chat logs and other evidence of Copperhead's harassment, misinformation and criminal behavior

@strcat:matrix.org: That's fair. I just figured, by using the bot we could change it to 30 seconds of time wasted >> 1 post.

they are going to learn the hard way that attacking us no matter how they do it won't cause any long-term harm to us and causes far more harm to them

eventually they will learn

they aren't very bright

That's true

But we already knew that.

<strcat[m] "1 minute of my time wasted by th"> not very scalable. just keep posting links, i'll work on automating today.

it is scalable

I have years of James chat logs

you want a video of James high as fuck and singing like a cat? got it

lmao

they just need to leave us alone

Why not use a other platform, something like telegram idk

<strcat[m] "you want a video of James high a"> Lmao XD

Too make it harder for them

this is our community

<strcat[m] "it is scalable"> meaning you can't be awake 24/7. going to help boost with my bots so maybe you can sleep.

if you want to help spread / promote the posts I linked above

<timeo[m] "Too make it harder for them"> Evience

spread the posts

strcat[m]: I'd like that video pls

I want help with that not advice

<strcat[m] "you want a video of James high a"> Bruh are you serious

I am saving that for when I need it

<strcat[m] "I want help with that not advice"> not giving advise, will automate post replication and boosting. thx.

[phonehome]: don't spam

Just make sure not to get caight in bot filters.

don't automate anything

behaving like Copperhead gets you banned from this room

no sockpuppets, no spamming, no raiding channels

I'd like everyone to take a step back and think guys

Don't do anything rash

if you behave like that you're a Copperhead supporter not a GrapheneOS supporter

exactly my thoughts

please do stuff in individual capacity

i didnt think i was. i meant as you drop posts they would be pushed via a twitter account. apologies if you felt otherwise.

Right now that's exactly the kind of thing they want us to do

don't automate anything

I'm asking for people to help share / spread posts organically

will do

don't use sockpuppets, don't use bots, don't spam, don't bother people about it

don't post it places it isn't relevant

"Unfortunately due to widespread violation of our license and expanding resource requirements, CopperheadOS became a paid product" lol

don't bring it up when it's not the topic

Okie

[phonehome]: please go through what they accuse us of

i dont want you to convice them

but any rash behavior only feeds them

think they gave up on raiding the channel for now

that's how it works

they have to learn there are consequences for them

and then they'll stop hurting themselves

<take_a_deep_brea "but any rash behavior only feeds"> copy that.

the only thing that will stop them is self-interest

so when they do something like raiding the channel, we are going to inflict pain on them by spreading evidence showing their harassment, threats, misinformation campaign, etc.

and btw not targeting you or anything, just saying

respond to them with facts

politely presenting facts and tearing down their lies

do not engage in their behavior

anyone doing that kind of thing is very likely one of their sockpuppets

because we always tell people not to do it

nope they haven't given up yet

matrix lagging like shit for me

Copperhead is not above making sockpuppets pretending to be GrapheneOS users/supporters trying to make us look bad

in reality it only makes them look bad because it's obvious

and we have proof

if they start spamming stuff just ping me

Copperhead's CEO is the yandere dev of android developers, stealing code, harassing others who did actual work, and living in a never ending echo chamber

penpal: no

Whatever yanderedev did is his problem

Don't create more enemies here

<anupritaisno1[m] "Don't create more enemies here"> You're right, apologies

Just saw parallels that's all

I don't think that guy raided other people's channels, sent legal threats to students threw trash off his balcony at other people or start a huge misinformation campaign

* I don't think that guy raided other people's channels, sent legal threats to students, threw trash off his balcony at other people or start a huge misinformation campaign

* I don't think that guy raided other people's channels, sent legal threats to students, threw trash off his balcony at other people or started a huge misinformation campaign

* I don't think that guy raided other people's channels, sent legal threats to students, threw trash off his balcony at other people, stole donations or started a huge misinformation campaign

All day copperhead news..

Avoid spreading libel or slandering people here

Is there anything i can do too help out with getting those jerks gone

* Is there anything i can do too help out with getting those jerks away

timeo: tag Daniel when you see one

Already explained earlier

<anupritaisno1[m] "Avoid spreading libel or slander"> Keeping that in mind from now on, I shouldn't have made that comment.

<anupritaisno1[m] "timeo: tag Daniel when you see o"> Anthing else? Or only that?

Avoid replying to the trolls

Best case they'll just ignore you. Worst case you'll say something that makes the whole community look bad

strcat

Hey, i can really use some help

sundude: me too

With installing

CopperheadOS I know

??

sundude: please see grapheneos.org/install

<anupritaisno1[m] "Avoid replying to the trolls"> you too lol

Haha ok

strcat another one

wow what is happening here...

wow

How do you know?

everything has been removed

look at the frickin name

and so many copperhead things on freenode

*nick

Oh i didnt see lol

you think any sane person would do that lmfao

take_a_deep_breath|mare: also that's like basically proof that James is directly involved in this attack

somenerd: they've been raiding the channels for 12 hours or something

He fucked up there

> somenerd: they've been raiding the channels for 12 hours or something

yeah

That's a copy of madaidan's words

Who other than James knows those lol

lmao

everytime I come on, there's some or the other troll

please stop talking about it here

I will ban them when they come

yeah will stop now

discussing of it is off-topic

* discussion of it is off-topic

not productive, and will basically make them succeed

they have earned 5 more posts of evidence on Reddit today

on both subreddits

+ linking them here and on Twitter

* + linking them here and on Twitter

if they don't leave us completely alone tomorrow, same thing

any attack they make on us will be met with a far more successful evidence-based response

they have had almost 3 years to learn this and have not yet learned

I hope that soon, they will finally learn that they should leave us alone and drop their attacks

One day they will learn, i hope lol

they are going to lose in court, they are going to lose on social media, and obviously they have nothing to offer of any value when it comes to technical merit

they just get more and more desperate

This just so sad

To do

look at their CEO trying to get that security researcher fired for sending them a single message with single character: a middle finger emoji

James is unhinged and delusional

this is completely unhinged

<strcat[m] "they are going to lose in court,"> When is that

this is what we are dealing with

people who spend their time repeatedly making Matrix accounts to spam

Imagine being so petty

James I mean

But it's off-topic

Mhm other one?

doesn't look like it

nah

probs not

let me deal with it

<strcat[m] "let me deal with it"> Your doing a good job, so a 👍for you :)

how does Copperhead have no negative reviews on the BBB

m_b_: BBB is an extortion scam

<strcat[m] "m_b_: BBB is an extortion scam"> fair

please just let me deal with the spammers and try to discuss other things again

what are the differences between linux-hardened and KSPP? afaict both are basically the same

KSPP is the effort to upstream changes

linux-hardened is a downstream patch set supplementing the upstream work

somenerd: kspp enables upstream hardening stuff

And provides recommendations

* somenerd: kspp enables upstream hardening stuff and basically tries to get features landed upstream

I see, so they're trying to replicate (or achieve parity with) grsecurity?

somenerd: unlikely

or is it meant to be less hardened

somenerd: it's not *meant to be* less hardened

There's a lot of internal politics going on rn

somenerd: the reality is that very few people are interested in building something comparable

somenerd: lack of contributors / resources -> no it is not going to be the same

wish that grsec stayed public

would've been really amazing

somenerd: they didn't get the support they needed

I think i found a exploit but i dont know where to post it

somenerd: and then it all fell apart

yoynef: please see our responsible disclosure policy

> somenerd: they didn't get the support they needed

yeah, don't think that upstream helped much (if at all)

yoynef is likely the same person as before btw

yoynef: substantiate that please

yoynef: give details and proof

@strcat:matrix.org: assuming good faith that's all

But i was liking to talk about it

Oke

yoynef: ok, please send me a private message and give details/proof

It has to do with a option in securty settings

1 sec

yoynef: you've been told to private message

Please do as instructed

Do not talk about vulnerabilities in a public chat. Responsible disclosure is a thing

anupritaisno1: I mean

they can post about it here

I don't really care

but only if they substantiate it

it's not permitted to make unsubstantiated claims / insinuations

@strcat:matrix.org: better if it's private

anyway as I said

based on the detection script

likely the same person as before

@strcat:matrix.org: script?

yoynef: I opened a private room with you, you're welcome to post all the details there and substantiate the claim

Will do

@strcat:matrix.org: any chance I could join?

just leave it be for now

Huge chance I'll have to look into it anyway

Kk

will see if there is anything to it

it's the same troll as before

Oh woah

this is a nice example of how Copperhead sends people pretending to be GrapheneOS users to concern troll

:/

this is what concern trolling means: they come here pretending to have some legitimate concern with the intent of spreading misinformation and then likely pretending they were wrongfully banned

I am going to be very promptly banning people who spread misinformation or unsubstantiated claims due to Copperhead heavily using sockpuppets + concern trolling

we have security⊙go for people who want to report a security vulnerability (no one has ever used that email legitimately, just to spam)

(people either send spam there or try to use it as a way of making their request for help / features higher priority)

I think it really says a lot about Copperhead that they resort to these desperate tactics

and, as I will continue to demonstrate, every time they attempt to harm us, we will respond with evidence-based posts about their scamming and criminal behavior

each time they do this, they dig their hole deeper

@strcat:matrix.org: I think it's really unlikely our code would have vulns tbh

We do focus on getting stuff done correctly

strcat[m]: You spend a lot of time talking about those asshats. I get it, but let the community handle it.

dnull: no

dnull: the community is unfortunately not capable of dealing with their concern trolling

Just ignore it for now

strcat if you ever get harassed by users from our instance, be sure to let me know

dnull: I'm responding to active raids of the channels and attempts to cause harm to us

Lets just wait for the court day

dnull: if I don't deal with it people are going to fall for the concern trolling

I backed them into a corner and they just decided to go back to trying to hurt my feelings lol

We are just adding fual to the fire

timeo: that's a Copperhead narrative

timeo: they are actively spreading misinformation and causing harm to us

timeo: the lawsuit was filed by Copperhead primarily as a way of intimidating our contributors

If they ain't waiting for the court day and spread their capping, why should they expect silence?

timeo: they want to scare people way from using or contributing to GrapheneOS, they repeatedly harasss and threaten people

timeo: their lawsuit doesn't have a legal basis

timeo: they cannot genuinely expect to win, you are falling for their manipulation

anyway, as I said before

I expect people to let me deal with this

<strcat[m] "timeo: they want to scare people"> I get that, but trolls loves this things

timeo: just stop, let me deal with it

timeo: it's you derailing the topic

Good idea

I know how to deal with it, and I don't need advice

timeo: it's appreciated if you stop replying. Please realise that developers are replying to you. The more our time is wasted the less time we spend doing work that actually matters

I told everyone in the channel how they can help already

Anyway I'm out now

people can help by spreading the Reddit posts I linked earlier with evidence of their wrongdoing

5 posts (each made to both subreddits)

I don't need advice

I know far more about what's happening than any of you, and I have a lawyer who I talk to regularly

my lawyer's advice is CERTAINLY not that we simply let them cause harm to us and wait for the legal system to sort them out

so, please don't give me advice

you don't know what you're talking about

thanks

<strcat[m] "I told everyone in the channel h"> I sure you do but they are coming back all day and is getting to that point that we cant't chat normal anynore

just let him ban

* I sure you do but they are coming back all day and is getting to that point that we cant't chat normal anymore

so stop talking about it

and then move on-topic

that's it

stop trying to give me advice and stop talking about

they're succeeding if you continue talking

Oh sorry

there has no been any troll in the channel for a while

* there has not been any troll in the channel for a while

<strcat[m] "we have security⊙go "> I'm curious if there was ever a security researcher who tried to find a vulnerability in GrapheneOS?

yes

there are people who regularly help review/audit the code

ssi.gouv.fr/en has helped with making hardened_malloc more robust recently

we are already very regularly reviewing / improving our own code

Degoogled, Hardened FuchsiaOS when?: we are deliberately doing things in ways that reduce risk from mistakes, etc.

Degoogled, Hardened FuchsiaOS when?: people not finding any serious issues is not an indication that they haven't been looking for them

it took a long time for hardened_malloc to reach v1

that's the most complex code we have

spookyyraccoon: recommend reading grapheneos.org/faq#encryption

up to you if you want to use different passwords

they still have totally separate and different encryption keys

if you use the same password

<strcat[m] "Degoogled, Hardened FuchsiaOS wh"> I agree with that, I was just wondering

<strcat[m] "ssi.gouv.fr/en has "> They're also helping with linux-hardened

a compromise of the device while 1 profile is logged in and a 2nd one is not would not provide access to the data in the 2nd one even if they share a password

> They're also helping with linux-hardened

that's cool

anyway that spamming seems to have stopped for the time being after their concern trolling attempt went super badly

well, glad that it stopped for now

probably means they're moving on to other forms of attacks

spreading misinformation somewhere

keep an eye out and try to do your best to represent the community well by taking an evidence-based approach to countering them

Just move on

been going on for 12 hours so...

you have the freedom to stop thinking about it, I have to stay here watching the chat rooms

because I don't intend to close it to new people coming

and let them win like that

Hi all. Just wanted to say thank you for all the great work. I managed to compile, sign and deploy my own version of GrapheneOS per the build manual on Debian 11. Everything looks great so far.

well it is the former name of the project

I fully intend to get the historical domain too

we used the name before Copperhead existed

and btw they do not have permission to use their logo from the person who made it

Is there any way to configure GrapheneOS to deny network permissions by default?

sonic_the_hedgehog: no but you can go toggle it off before apps are able to launch

no, it's on by default for compatibility

sonic_the_hedgehog: they can't launch right after being installed til you start them

it would be possible to make a toggle

for changing the default for newly installed apps

can't be done by default

If I wantet to make such a toggle in the source, where would I start?

frameworks/base and look at the commit making infrastructure for special Sensors/Network permissions

and packages/apps/PackageInstaller

and then the toggle has to be in packages/apps/Settings

ok, sounds great, I'll have a look.

Would it theoretically be possible to put a toggle into the installation pop-up, so the permission can be decided each time an app gets installed?

no, since the apps request the perms

GrapheneOS can't determine if an app needs the network permission or not

Uhrzeigersinn: it could be a post-installation prompt

Uhrzeigersinn: similar to how legacy apps are handled

Uhrzeigersinn: but it's too complex

<somenerd[m] "GrapheneOS can't determine if an"> I know, thats the reason for my idea. I do understand the discussion above. I'm not talking about the standard permission request pop-up, I'm talking about the little pop-up asking if I actually want to install the app. Just a little switch saying "grant network access" or so, when you hit "install".

<strcat[m] "Uhrzeigersinn: but it's too comp"> Alright. Idea just popped into my head.

Uhrzeigersinn: there is a way it could be done as a post-install promopt

* Uhrzeigersinn: there is a way it could be done as a post-install prompt

pre-API-23 apps have a prompt for their permissions list before they can launch

because the apps themselves do not handle runtime permissions

similar to how apps don't have handling of Network and Sensors existing

Uhrzeigersinn: but it would be too complex

<strcat[m] "sonic_the_hedgehog: they can't l"> Sounds like the normal behavior, then how come some apps, sometimes like Aurora Store starts after being installed sometimes (its force stop is not greyed out)? (Is it due to it being not in force stopped state on other users with same app?)

Uhrzeigersinn: it's too much for us to port to each new OS version

beyond what we already have

Degoogled, Hardened FuchsiaOS when?: they start out force stopped, it's per-user

you can check with `pm`

<strcat[m] "you can check with `pm`"> Okay, will do.

To me having a toggle to deny network permissions to newly installed apps sounds good enough, and would fit well into my personal workflow. I would expect that the app gives some kind of feedback when it can't work because of missing network. Then can can actively decide to grant that permission or not.

As a non-techie type, just wanted to say thank you to those developing/contributing to GOS project. Thanks for the hard work! GOS has been excellent so far for me.

<strcat[m] "and btw they do not have permiss"> hahaha.....who made it? If you're at liberty to say.

And good job last night trudging through the trolls...

The spell checker does not appear to use the second language that I have set in system. Is it only me?

dannyknoll3: twitter.com/dmix made it and Copperhead was founded as a company after he was already gone, and never had permission to use it (the open source project does)

anyway using the logo is pretty questionable

dmix owns it and the license is unclear

Does Graphene some sort of crypto-shredding when doing a factory reset?

larti.klosac: Please go through grapheneos.org/faq#encryption

it deals with how profile deletion and factory reset are handled

> Weaver also provides reliable wiping of data since the secure element can reliably wipe a Weaver slot. Deleting a profile will wipe the corresponding Weaver slot and a factory reset of the device wipes all of the Weaver slots. The secure element also provides insider attack resistance preventing firmware updates before authenticating with the owner profile.

just the relevant part . please go through rest of it for context .

In which folder does the web install download the image?

came2complain[m]: doesn't download it to a folder

to the device directly?

no

came2complain[m]: it's a web page so it can't just read/write files on the OS filesystem

web pages have storage

How do I ensure system updates are downloaded over Tor when using multiple user profiles? Do I need to be using a Tor VPN on the currently focused user or can I just have a Tor VPN running on the owner account?

on the current user

Hello

strcat: oi m8

bruv, will grapheneos support android's built-in FIDO2 functionality?

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: Android has built-in USB, NFC and hardware keystore functionality not specifically FIDO2

dan-is-a-bloody-: There is support for NFC and WebUSB devices on GrapheneOS. However, FIDO2/U2F support on Android depends on a library normally bundled by Play Services. It's likely this library could be extracted or a cleanroom implementation could be done that could be included into GrapheneOS.

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: it all works properly on GrapheneOS

TheJollyRoger: *some implementations* of it do

Oh. Ohhhhhh, I see.

boys that's proper it really is but websites want FIDO2 for passwordless login (PIN)

i've tried it and now i cant go back how is FIDO2 not a standard everywhere? just fingerprint on ur phone and wham-bam-thank you m'am

ur phone is always with u its so nice

no need to type in the fucking OTP codes

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: and it works fine on GrapheneOS in an app implementing it

oh i see u just need an app

fuck i searched "FIDO2" on f-droid and cudnt find shit

not really what I'm saying

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: most apps choose to use the Play services library for it

strcat[m]: oh I see, makes sense now.

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: which doesn't work without Play services

So if the app does it on its own, in-house, then it works, just that most apps don't do this... huh.

that's why it doesn't work in Chromium browsers right now

strcat: no m8 i go thru the browser

we know, lol

ye it needs to work in vanadium or firefox or whatever

yeah and Chromium only has an implementation based on Play services right now

it's not an OS issue

it's an app issue

FUCK why does it always have to be so shit

why cant shit just WORK

we don't need to implement it in the OS

that all works fine

we need to implement it in Chromium rather than using Play services

we can't make it work in apps choosing to implement it via Play services

has anyone here ever used FIDO2? its a godsend

yes

yes

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: anyway what we need is someone to work on it

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: we know

it's an open issue somewhere

there's an open issue upstream in Chromium too

how much money do i need to pay

no one working on stuff -> nothing gets done

so that someone works on it

it's not a money issue

it's a lack of someone working on it issue

im talking about using the android device as the FIDO2 key btw, not using an external key with NFC on the phone

if I had people I could trust to get work done who weren't busy

there are dozens of projects I would fund today

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: yeah that's what we would implement

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: we'd likely implement it as a per-app hardware keystore based feature

because every phone we support has 2x FIDO2 compliant keystores

2x?

TEE and HSM (ofc we'd use the HSM)

the TEE uses fingerprint reader for confirmation

the HSM uses power button

what about entering a pin

HSM seems least secure

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: that's not what FIDO2 spec does

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: HSM is far more secure than the TEE

how so?

i guess you're not including physical security

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: because it's a dedicated secure element with tiny attack surface?

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: it does have better physical security

hsm + pin wud be perfect

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: a PIN doesn't make any sense

why? something you have + something u know

any thief can press ur power button

because you are entering the PIN via the OS...

it doesn't make any sense

it has 0 value

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: FIDO2 is usually used for 2FA auth alongside a password, you already have a password

oh i see wat u mean

ye phone pin + power button works

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: adding a PIN to FIDO2 doesn't make sense

unless you enter it for the HSM via secure input

there is no point of entering a PIN in the OS

<strcat[m] "dan-is-a-bloody-legend: FIDO2 is"> no, FIDO2 is for passwordless

U2F uses password

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: no, that's 1 option

you're wrong

nope

U2F is the old protocol

yes, and FIDO2 is usually used with a password

whether or not a password is required is out of scope for us

i know that the websites set if u use pw or not but the FIDO alliance specifically is pushing for passwordless whenever FIDO2 is used

okay but it's usually used with a password

and again

out of scope for us

anyway yeah

phone PIN + power button is good enough

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: there *isn't a way* to make it require a PIN

i certainly wouldn't set a yubikey passwordless unless there's a pin on the yubikey

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: asking for a PIN in the OS to use it is not hardware-based security...

you were asking for the impossible

the phone does not come with a separate touchscreen for secure input on the secure element

<strcat[m] "dan-is-a-bloody-legend: there *i"> there is for yubikey and other hw keys

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: and, again you're confused

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: I suggest reading about the hardware keystore

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: keys can be set to require that the phone is unlocked

the point of this is hardware-based security

no there's no need to discuss cuz u already specified the phone PIN so that's good enough 4 me

there is no reason for us to ask for a PIN in the OS for using this... it makes no sense

if the phone didnt have a PIN then it wud be pretty dangerous, someone who stole ur phone wud be able to FIDO2 into everything

no

only things using it without a password

and again, FIDO2 is usually used as 2FA

no, FIDO2 is meant to replace passwords

regardless, FIDO2 is usually used with a password

even if some websites aren't implementing it that way, it's the standard

and even if a site offers using it without one

they probably offer using it with one

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: you're incorrect

question i am trying to install grapheneos on moto g7 power (ocean) but i am not able to lock the boot loader after install anyone try to install graphene on any other device with similar issies?

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: I don't need you to wrongly explain a technical topic that I know well to me

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: and?

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: as I said before, it's usually used with a password, and even if a site primarily uses it without one they can offer 2FA

ok i get it in ur experience most websites implement FIDO2 with password

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: using FIDO2 as 1st factor with password as optional 2nd factor makes sense, sure

Brian87 I thought graphene can only be installed on pixel devices.

<Brian87 "question i am trying to install "> grapheneos.org/faq#supported-devices

That device is not supported

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: it's not within the scope of a FIDO2 implementation to do what you are saying

im not saying it should do anything, the phone is already secure with a PIN

but get a hw key like a yubikey and set up a microsoft azure login and you'll see that ur hw key now requires a PIN to use

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: using FIDO2 as the only authentication factor is fine but sites can and should still offer 2FA as an option

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: and again

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: out of scope

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: and the standard certainly does not say that they shouldn't offer 2FA

you're very wrong

they're encouraged to use FIDO2 as primary authentication method

i didn't say that the standard is requiring no 2FA, i'm just saying FIDO2 is meant to allow the world to transition to passwordless

that does not mean they are told not to offer password as optional 2nd factor

which means if it gets adopted that's eventually what we'll have

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: yes, it's meant to allow that, not meant to *force* it

Brian87: have you made a build for the moto g7 ???

i never said it meant to force it

dan-is-a-bloody-legend: it is not meant to *remove the option* of 2FA

didnt say it did

you implied it

no i did not

you misinterpreted me

this is how you're supposed to implement it: you can choose between using FIDO2 or password as your primary authentication mechanism

now, you did that, you can choose to enable 2FA

I use graphen and a base code but leanag  os as a gide to put graphene on moto g 7 but i am not able to relockk the boot loader the phone goes into boot loop once i lock the boot loader

2FA could be a password if your primary auth method is FIDO2

Brian87: so, not GrapheneOS

Brian87: we can't support non-GrapheneOS OSes here

Brian87: most moto phones don't allow bootloader to be locked

Yes i  use leanage as a fide code to i copy it

Brian87: we don't know about that phone, they likely don't support flashing a custom verified boot key and locking

Brian87: yeah, it's off-topic

it's not GrapheneOS at all

Hello, can I use the web installer on Pop!_OS?

rishabhksingh: not one of the officially supported/tested OSes but probably works fine

i made a build of graphne using lineage os so is graphene for moto g 7

that's not GrapheneOS

at all

@strcat:matrix.org: alright, thank you ^^

Brian87: you used some bits and pieces of our code to make a new OS

it's not GrapheneOS

we don't have any clue about the details of that phone and whether it supports verified boot / locking with an alternate OS

it likely does not support doing it

and you're not trying to install GrapheneOS on it

you're trying to install an OS you made, with some GrapheneOS code

what do u call it

i use lineage as a guide i did not put lineage and graphene into one OS is graphne build for moto g 7 but is not stable

it's not GrapheneOS

the boot loader and everything is graphene

name: Not-GrapheneOS

no, it's not GrapheneOS

so?

so, this is the channel for GrapheneOS

guess so

that device probably doesn't meet the requirements for a port of GrapheneOS

so id someone builds graphene for pixel 8 when it comes out its not graphene =)

and what he's trying to use is not GrapheneOS but rather his fork of the OS with the core components like the kernel from elsewhere

Brian87: a substantially different fork of GrapheneOS is not GrapheneOS

what are you actually trying to achieve? graphene stuff with something else?

also recommend reading grapheneos.org/faq#trademark (`What about the GrapheneOS name and logo?` section)

ok i will go to android developers site to see if they can help with the boot loader issues

Brian87: as I said

Brian87: the device very likely doesn't support verified boot / locking with an alternate OS

most do not

most devices do not have the required functionality for a port of GrapheneOS

that device likely lacks a dozen major things that are required for official support

and you may think what you have is GrapheneOS but you're not using a kernel or device support code from GrapheneOS

it really isn't

i get that but i want graphene on my moto g 7 now so i build it myself leanage os is not as secure

what are you going to name "Not-grapgeneOS" U ARE CREATING

it's your own OS based on code from GrapheneOS and elsewhere

🤦‍♂️

is open sorce how is cheating to make things work for different devices

<strcat[m] "it's your own OS based on code f"> cool

They both recently joined. Think theyre trolling

who are they?

I am in the mood if people here accept

😁

so there is no way to lock the boot loader of moto g 7 unless i flash back to stock rom?

Brian87: it may not even support that

thats bad

most devices do not support verified boot / locking the bootloader with an alternate OS

among other things they do not support with them

many devices cannot be locked again at least realistically after using something else

Brian87: do they actually offer a download of factory images to flash?

you may not be able to easily fully restore it to a pristine copy of a stock OS release where you can lock it

i see

well thank you for your help

apreciate it

entry1[m]: do not think Brian87 is trolling, larsinbars was and admitted to it so yeah

<Brian87 "so there is no way to lock the b"> can only speak for moto g6, you can relock but you dont recieve ota updates anymore

they left already

apologize peeps, but m watching. 😁

* I apologize peeps, but m watching. 😁

Hello all - can we know which app does GOS use for say dialer, contacts, gallery, camera - so a list of apps that GOS has

those are all aosp guess

ya, want to know which one's are included in GOS

some aosp stuff, vanadium(custom chrome)

no gplay serves

rest will tell tell the peeps with expertise

😁

also awesome battery backup forgot to mention

eyeoftiger: we're not into bundling apps

eyeoftiger: grapheneos.org/faq#bundled-apps

eyeoftiger: Seedvault is the only externally developed non-AOSP app we bundle and only because it has to be built into the base OS and made into the backup provider for the OS to work

@strcat:matrix.org: I got a S20 from samsung and am trying to de-google and install aosp/GOS apps

wish GOS was compatible/certified with S20

<eyeoftiger[m] "@strcat:matrix.org: I got a S20 "> I have an Mi A2 just working out things with custom roms ryt now, waiting for mi a2 support

I removed lots of bloatware and then some google.android packages and it broke the OS, had to rest to factory 3 times

but don't have any play services, have F-droid, arora store

so far seems to be good

welcome yzernik

Hello. I previously setup SeedVault to backup on my Pixel 3A XL but at some point, probably after an update, I no longer saw backups happening.

When I go to Settings -> System I see that Backup says "Off" and when I click on "Backup" I am taken to a black settings screen which used to show the SeedVault page. Are there currently any issues?

Is this where lost souls end up who run into issues with the GrapheneOS installation guide?

no this is where lost souls come and fet a new life with GOS

* no this is where lost souls come and get a new life with GOS

Should I go ahead and paste the contents of my console that's been stuck flashing the same file for 20 minutes now or should I find somewhere else to ask installation questions?

NewUser did you follow the official instructions on the GrapheneOS website?

as best I could I followed CLI install.  I got to "Flashing Factory Images" before I encountered what appears to be a hang.

What computer are you using? What USB port? What operating system?

Acer predator, USB C on the side, Ubuntu 18.04.5 LTS

<NewUser "as best I could I followed CLI i"> Have you tried the web install? That is what is recommended.

NewUser you could try running the web install inside Chromium/Chrome. Otherwise this might become a lengthy troubleshooting procedure

Ok, I'll do that.  Hopefully I won't be back.  Was hoping to avoid installing chromium if I could.  If its so strongly preferred then you may want to add it to the troubleshooting guide on the CLI page.

"Officially supported browsers for the web install method: Chromium" is already on the website

Chromium itself is okay, you should give it a try

It does say it at the start of the CLI page

"The web installer is an easier approach to installing the official releases via a browser with WebUSB support."

so it does

NewUser: if you followed the instructions exactly but it still didn't work, it could be the usb-c port on the laptop (it's mentioned in the guide that it often doesn't work properly). Should work better with a usb-a to c cable

<alex-resist "Chromium itself is okay, you sho"> alex-resist: pardon my ignorance, so Chromium is google chrome ?

<eyeoftiger[m] "alex-resist: pardon my ignorance"> Not exactly. Chromium is the base for Google Chrome. It is open source and partially decoupled from Google. Most Linux distributions do provide chromium in their package repository.

ok TY,

hmm I'm seeing the normal settings on my Pixel 3a, same build version

RoyValentine: in your settings menu search for seedvault

Make sure its not disabled

Maybe clear its storage?

can you disable it even?

clearing storage would clear his already existing backup keys wouldn't it?

If its not working think its worth a try

I would plug into a device and run adb logcat, and see if and what errors are present

Find the issue, before clearing the issue

Just means you'd have to write down a new restore code

<TheJollyRoger "morepheus_x: I can't do a walkth"> Thanks for the reply, I think you meant to say, I would damage the phone. Let me explain the situation, I've partially installed GOS. i.e. I installed twice due to disconnections and connections during the flashing process. However, I've I can't get out of fastboot mode. I've made several judgement decision that led me to here. 1 i was using a Debian and

Firefox +> So I tried the CLI method, because the buttons on web download version didn't work on Firefox. I know that the recommended method is the webbrowser(chrome) method. However, you must have gotten to the preferred method via trial and error. I am sure somewhere in your compatibility testing someone has experienced what I went through. Now, I am trying to reinstall the original OS, then perform an

update then install GOS. Initially, I was worried that any update after I turned on the device could comprise the device. Silly Huh? Updates that comprise devices? So, now I am at the point of either trying it from a Windows machine or continue to try it from a Linux distro..