Interesting!

Thatcher: cool, thanks for sharing. Curious, what do you use for bookmarking? I'm currently in the process of trying to back up all 378 bookmarks on Vanadium.

Holy moly lol

hi Stephen you online?

i mean strcat

>.>

Rip briar doesn't work over Bluetooth on graphene

faxing: Works on my phones

Weird

Maybe I'm missing something -- just enable Bluetooth on the settings of both phones, keep them close together, send the message. Right?

Yep

Just tested on 2 phones loaded with graphene (internet and over WiFi tired off) and it works

<akc3n[m] "Thatcher: cool, thanks for shari"> I bookmark sites by sharing the link with the Note to Self features in Signal and Threema

<Thatcher[m] "I bookmark sites by sharing the "> Thanks for the tip.

In a secondary profile at least, Osmand no longer works with the internet permission denied

At least on my end

<VixenXY "Just tested on 2 phones loaded w"> Weird -- doesn't for me.

<akc3n[m] "Thatcher: cool, thanks for shari"> Xbrowsersync is your friend: xbrowsersync.org

Let's take this to #grapheneos-offtopic:matrix.org though.

<Cliff[m] "What kind of 4 messengers are th"> Threema element Telegramm and fairmail. At least those are the ones active in the background

Hey guys, I am installing GrapheneOs. So I downloaded an image from "Releases" page, because "Download" button in Installation page is too slow. Is there a way to use it?

<Kazan "Hey guys, I am installing Graphe"> grapheneos.org/install/cli

thanks will look

Is there a fast way to shutdown/quickly lock system? Currently only way to do this seems to be -> bring phone out of pocket -> hold side key button -> look for and click power button via touch screen.

Just seems unintuitive for security purposes.

sendapollo:

> GrapheneOS enables support for ending secondary user profile sessions after logging into them. It adds an end session button to the lockscreen and in the global action menu accessed by holding the power button. This fully purges the encryption keys and puts the profiles back at rest. This can't be done for the owner profile without rebooting due to it encrypting the sensitive system-wide operating system data.

sendapollo: grapheneos.org/faq#security-and-privacy

hi

im using a german tor guard node

hetzner host in german country

the most wiretapped tor node

anyvody here with pixel 5?

how is the pixel 5 with graphene compared to pixel 4a?

sendapollo: you can hold the power button for 10-15 seconds and it will reboot into the owner profile.

Question: anyone know if there is a setting that prevents me from adding an APN? I add one and hit save but it isn't saved. Tried many times

jjstopper: support.google.com/pixelphone/search?q=Apn looks like a google issue. Try removing and reinserting simcard.

catfish: thanks

is there a ethernet adapter that should work out of the box?

strcat are you online

Reklu

 

are there any security risks when not updating a phone to the latest version of the stock os before flashing graphene OS?

came2complain[m]: No, you're just recommended to do so anyway before you have issues during install

<came2complain[m] "are there any security risks whe"> Why wouldn't the stock OS be up-to-date?

when u buy the device it doesnt come with android11

and the latest security updates

Weird...

why would that be weird

they were manufactured months ago

came2complain[m] AOSP's not backward compatible, so if your installing a newer OS on an older system it may cause dependancy issues and break the install

hello

When i try install graphene on google pixel 5 it says me no compatible device found from chrome

CLI or Web-Installer?

I'm still amazed just how good this OS is after 18 months of daily use !

hi. i keep having this insanely problematic issue that if i am on a call with someone, and another calls comes in, the current call is simply shut down by my phone (im not touching anything), and the incoming one is showing the screen where i can choose to answer or not (the regular one, as with any incoming call).

i havent found a setting for this, so can someone enlighten me as to what's causing this and how to make it not close the current call?

one day i'll be on a seriously important call and it's shut down and it will be bad :O

it's on a pixel 4a with the latest grapheneos on it.

That sounds like a device issue and not the OS.

<K​ileXt> Ask your carrier, it might a setting on their side

GrapheneOS-Teleg: i could do that. i'd be surprised if it's a carrier thing, but come to think of it it could very well be (they have the ability to shut down a call of course)

i take it neither of you peeps here know of a setting in grapheneos to control this behavior then?

hello guys. I have installed GRAPHENEOS few weeks ago, and i still have a problem with notifications for viber, whatsapp and wickerme

i do activate all notification settings  for push messages and backround connecttions

and still notihing....

if i want to read my messages - i need to enter the app and only then - i can see my new messages

no chacne to receive my new messages in real time

For apps that rely on `Google Play services` for their notification system, you will not be able to receive live notifications.

im using ayrora store, without registration (anonimus user)

AURORA STORE

for app download

Most apps on Aurora store needs Play Services for notifications

i use to read links you send me , but i still dont understand what should i do to activate notifications

to install google play ad ?

google play service AD ?

i did it, but still there is no real time notifications

is it necessary to register an aurora account ?

or to download google play store and register my account ?

Google Play Services is not part of GrapheneOS and never will be. If the app depends of them the notifications will not work.

^

<marshall12 "or to download google play store"> grapheneos.org/faq#google-services

is wickerme independent of google play servicer or not ?

it is very imoprant for me

all depends of wickerme

for me and my need

needs

I dont use it so I dont know

marshall12: It's dependent

marshall12: All you can do is go to the people who write that app and either request, petition or coerce them to write their app in such a way that it no longer requires Google Play Services for full functionality. That's all you can do from your chair.

There is no app you can install, and no setting you can configure.

The developers have written their app in such a way that it is broken without Google being deeply integrated into and a part of your phone's operating system.

Look into something called microg, should allow you to run it

Is this the correct place to ask questions about the installation process of grapheneOS?

I guess

In grapheneos.org/install/cli#obtaining-factory-images when it states to curl (or use the website) the files downloaded are empty or something. The website leads to releases.grapheneos.org/sunfish-factory-2021.04.22.20.zip a 404 for every device that I have checked so I am unable to fetch the zip's for the pixel 4a. Is there a server nginx problem or am I doing something incorrectly?

* In grapheneos.org/install/cli#obtaining-factory-images when it states to curl (or use the website) the files downloaded are empty or something. The website (releases.grapheneos.org/sunfish-factory-2021.04.22.20.zip) leads to a 404 (and similarly for every device that I have checked) so I am unable to fetch the zip's for the pixel 4a. Is there a server nginx problem or am I doing something incorrectly?

* In grapheneos.org/install/cli#obtaining-factory-images when it states to curl (or use the website) the files downloaded are empty or something. The website (releases.grapheneos.org/sunfish-factory-2021.04.22.20.zip) leads to a 404 (and similarly for every device that I have checked) so I am unable to fetch the zip's for the pixel 4a. Is there a server nginx problem or am I doing something incorrectly?

Under grapheneos.org/install/cli#flashing-factory-images

for windows the command "tar xvf sunfish-factory-2021.04.22.20.zip" returns "tar.exe: Error opening archive: Unrecognized archive format"

<marshall12 "i do activate all notification s"> You need to disable "Battery optimisations" for those apps

> <@freenode_marshall12:matrix.org> i do activate all notification settings  for push messages and backround connecttions

* You need to disable "Battery optimisations" for those apps. go to Settings->apps->Whatsapp-> App info -> Battery -> Battery Optimisation...

Can anyone confirm that the files are empty?

annoxi: issue should be resolved now

Yes files are OK now

Yup, it seems to be downloading. Thanks

please report issues with the services if you run into them

there are issue trackers for them and can also be reported to the devs

First time doing this. Do you mean to search on Github for someone/something and make a note there or ping someone here?

the server configurations were tweaked a bit to deal with ongoing poor attempts at doing DoS attacks

one of the changes ~40 mins ago needed a little tweak to fix it

if someone had pinged me I'd have fixed it in 15 seconds

or if someone had filed an issue on the tracker for the service

if you don't report issues, they don't get fixed (please don't report other kinds of issues to me on Matrix/IRC, but something like that where a service is broken is fine)

I have read the contact form information. I will keep that in mind. I did not want to start pinging devs here so I just asked.

annoxi[m]: on behalf of the developers, the discretion's greatly appreciated! Welcome aboard.

does grapheneOS support any USB-C to ethernet adapters? are there any that will work out of the box?

this is the channel for GrapheneOS

Hello strcat If i have some apps installed in a second profile, do they run in background and work with push notifications? i have noticed in allot of other phones apps tend to idle allot on second profiles

i was wondering how stable is graphene in handling apps in background on secondary profile

* i was wondering how stable is graphene in handling apps within the background on secondary profile

Is grapheneOS only for Google pixel phone?

devada: no but those are the officially supported devices with full support at this time

Can I make the is for my phone?

Oppo f1

Can I make the OS for my phone?

Oppo f1

it's open source

you can do what you want

most devices do not support the requirements to provide the expected security

so they can't be officially supported

lots of info available on the site

I know its open source but I don't know how to build for my own

Device

That's the problem

if you're asking here rather than working on it then it's probably not going to work out

Thanks for the info

hey i noticed if you go into bootloader and click show barcode , the phone outputs imei, seriel number sim EID etc

displaying this in bootloader is very compromising

is there a way to delete this or is it one of them things that has to stay haha

it's regulatory compliance and isn't compromising

not really sure what you mean by that

someone who has physical access to the device can inherently obtain those things

it's required that devices either have it on a label or a way to display it like that

that's why it has an option to display it as barcodes

regulatory compliance

take out your SIM tray

look at what's written across it

the IMEI

and of course it could just be obtained from the hardware itself

I understand your point, good point.

if someone has physical access to the device they can obtain that stuff from hw

the SSD, etc. also has identifiers

hardware has serial numbers, in general

most of the chips probably have serial numbers written on them and also obtainable from them

* most of the chips probably have serial numbers written on them and also often obtainable from them

from where are /proc/device-tree/chosen/cdt/cdb items populated?

device tree is filled in by the late stage bootloader

strcat: law enforcement will rely on that bootloader screen to get the imei etc, would be so funny to put some spoofed values there

haha

and is there a way to determine which mtdblock/offsets it reads these values from?

the IMEI is likely stored in the EFS as per qualcomm standards, but the wifi, bluetooth mac is like simply read from a static mtd offset

why would that be different?

implemented by the same baseband chip / firmware in separate sandboxes

the Wi-Fi / Bluetooth implementation is on the same chip

shibboleth: not clear what you're trying to accomplish

i'm trying to edit the devices bluetooth mac

is there no birthday date in contacts?

like a field to input the day I mean

graphene has wifi mac randomization, but i'd like to avoid disclosing the factory bluetooth mac from ever being used

used/disclosed, whatever

shibboleth: that's not how Bluetooth works

i get what you're saying

what makes you think a persistent identifier is disclosed?

but that's not entirely true

it's not very hard to determine the actual bluetooth mac

you

you'd need an ubertooth or a cambridge silicon bluetooth device with patched firmware, but it's not hard

or any of the likely umpteen bluetooth-bases solutions used in metro/retail/foo tracking

also, also: userland (droid) may have access to the burned-in bluetooth mac

all i wanna do is change the wifi and bluetooth mac *once* to avoid these UUIDs from being disclosed, then rely on userspace randomization from there

and these values are stored in some mtdblock at some specific offset

this isn't correct

i'm familiar with arm and device trees from openwrt and there it'd simply be a matter of looking at the device .dts to determine where these values are stored

what isn't correct?

the Bluetooth MAC address isn't revealed over the air as you're implying

you also seem to be assuming it's still a separate chip like when Broadcom Wi-Fi/Bluetooth was used

it worked a lot differently

ipq806x is an SOC just like with what we're used to in droid

hi

can anyone help installing grapheneos

👋🏻

in pixel 3

use grapheneos.org/install/web

what do I do when I go in to boot interface on the phone

strcat[m], github.com/pwnieexpress/blue_hydra

Guest777888: follow the steps there

that's for use with commodity/cots bluetooth adapters.

Guest777888: did you enable OEM unlocking as explained, then boot into the bootloader interface?

sep solutions for use with ubertooth or patched csi adapters to get the full, burned in bluetooth mac/uuid

shibboleth: tracking them through rotations of their random addresses doesn't imply the original MAC is obtained

as i've said: bluehydra doesn't do this with cots hw

but with an ubertooth you really can get the permanent mac.

I know the way it rotates doesn't prevent tracking but there shouldn't be any leaks of the hardware address over the air

but now we're going off on a tangent

nvm all that, does anyone know which file/where i can find the offsets being probed to determine the wifi/bt macs by droid/late bootloader?

I don't know how that's a tangent

you're making claims about that do not appear to be accurate an I'd like to know why you're saying that

as in: instead of answering my question you... challenge the basis for me wanting to do this

because what you say is the basis for wanting to do it would be a problem that should be fixed

strcat[m], github.com/greatscottgadgets/uberto…lob/master/host/doc/ubertooth-rx.md

that's classic bluetooth rather than BLE?

still bluetooth?

only BLE has privacy

after a fashion...

anyway, let's not make this a conversation about how bluetooth works, my question was re determining where in the efs/whatever these values are stored

Sorry for interrupting, but does GrapheneOS use linux as its kernel?

yes

Thanks!

what a weird question

"android" is, mostly a running fork of the linux kernel+userland tools

Android works with a mainline kernel

userspace stuff isn't the same as what traditional desktop/server distributions use

unclear what about userspace you're talking about specifically but it's not the same ALSA, *nix utilities, SELinux stuff, etc.

<rny[m] "what a weird question"> Its weird for you but someone learning new about mobile OS , isn't .

Hi

i thought it was weird because they just asked if its linux without any follow-up

<L​73689> Can i confirm is this correct, the Mac spoofer , at my place work when I turn WiFi off and on , each time my pixel connects, the router thinks its a new device, does it change the mac address each time it connects?

well, this also seems to be the default behavior in droid10/11

sep option in the developer options

what does?

the MAC randomization doesn't work the same way

not the same way, no

stock OS has 2 states (per-network), GrapheneOS adds a 3rd that it uses as the default

<L​73689> Yeah I've read this , its actually impressive if this is true, all I can see on the router is the pixel 5 showing as unknown and a different Mac everytime it connects ?

the stock OS one is a persistent address lasting as long as the dhcp lease

please read grapheneos.org/usage#wifi-privacy

<L​73689> Yeah I've read this mate but I just wanted to confirm

the documentation is a lot more reliable than the chat

settings list secure | grep bluetooth

is this one being used by graphene?

<L​73689> I agree I do like the documentation but for me to understand things I need to ask in different ways. And yes it's a pixel 5 with graphene but I didn't realise everytime the phone connects it changes the mac

@L73689 - by default, it is randomized. However, you can if you want to, change it to a per-network MAC, if say for instance, you do MAC address whitelisting on your home or workplace WiFi.

<L​73689> Thanks, yeah I noticed that option, i think it will be OK for me to leave it as randomizing :)

btw i noticed that since installing the update, rebooting the device is faster, is this one of the things fixed in the new update?

no

there's a changelog

nothing about that was changed

Yeah it was

It was changes in March

*changed

no

it wasn't

the changelog on the site is accurate

well, thats odd

im also assuming rebooting takes longer because of the memory hardening right?

it's not specifically that, no

then what else could it be?

regular reboots and rebooting after an update also really aren't the same thing

and the latter depends on how much the update changed

and how you installed it

well, normal reboots take pretty long

so idk

but the second reboot after i begun the install process was like way faster

nothing was changed that would make reboots faster

the changelog on the site is accurate

welp, guess it just werks better now

you don't need to ask what was changed, you can look there

cant complain

it doesn't work better now, that wasn't changed

<strcat[m] "you don't need to ask what was c"> true

you can't start measuring until the screen about booting an alternate OS goes away

because it pauses for 5 seconds before booting it unless you bypass the screen

booting really doesn't take that long

not really sure what you're talking about

also is there no way to get root access on graphene? i wanna try the out the bromite webview thing

depends on device model, can't compare it for the boot after an update (has to do extra work)

no offense to vanadium but i perfer bromite

* no offense to vanadium but i prefer bromite

no, you can't modify the OS

without making your own build

suggest reading the docs on the site

<strcat[m] "without making your own build"> is there a flag in the makefile or something that would allow you to do that

don't know what you mean

also my hardware isnt good enough to build it myself

<strcat[m] "don't know what you mean"> like is there an option in the build settings to enable the root acc or soemthing

no

there is no 'root account'

that's not how the OS works

there is never root accessible to the UI / application layer, it would fundamentally break the security model

<Ed[m] "like is there an option in the b"> Android does not have anything like root

already explained above

Even stuff like init is put in constrained domains

doesn't need to be repeated

man google really over engineered android what the hell

I don't know what you mean by that

Stuff like magisk works by introducing a permissive domain or making the init domain permissive and allowing untrusted_app and some other domains to transition to it

you appear to be concern trolling in the channel regularly

how exactly

Ed: there's no overengineering

That's how selinux works

my impression is they're being disingenuous and want to waste time

they're regularly here, they've seen detailed explanations for these things

I don't think it's productive, whether it's good faith or not

consider it concern trolling either way

<strcat[m] "consider it concern trolling eit"> Concern trolling is the new fad?

I don't think another detailed explanation of how the security model works is appropriate and I'm simply not interested in people derailing the channel and spreading misinformation here

Is it possible that voice calls via Bluetooth headphones are not possible in grapheme OS? I tried three different pairs of headphones and none of them work on a pixel 5 whereas on other android devices, no problem

panoramics[m]: They're working fine for me and always have been.

<strcat[m] "I don't think another detailed e"> I get that, too many dumb questions are being asked here that can be answered by reading the website

I just have a bunch of el-cheapo bluetooth adapters with microphones that I use for phone calls.

Works fine.

<TheJollyRoger "panoramics: They're working fine"> Care to share which ones you've been using? Having some air pods right now, not working somehow

Ah ok

Very strange

Taotronics TT-BR06

I had exactly those before, didn't work

Again, nothing special about it, the advantage with these things is that virtually every store has them, they're a dime a dozen.

Patrick: the issue is more people approaching asking questions as 'make inaccurate claims and force people to refute them'

Constant interruptions in connectivity. Only during calls though, not for listening to music

Patrick: I don't consider that asking a question

I use these for calls and music, working fine. May be a hardware issue on your end.

<strcat[m] "Patrick: the issue is more peopl"> Yeah fair

<TheJollyRoger "I use these for calls and music,"> Brand new pixel 5... I'd be surprised

Especially since for music, its no problem at all. I don't get it

it would be nice if people checked site, went with the detailed info there, and also checked for past conversations here

Well, if anyone else finds the same, hopefully they'll chime in.

but the issue is mainly this whole concern trolling thing

matrix is super broken

trying to unban them after talking to them

doesn't work

there are some stock OSes without Google apps/services integrated

AOSP is the starting point and doesn't have them

the stock OS adds them, AOSP doesn't remove them

it's the other way around from how it's portrayed

> <@jj1013.:privacytools.io> What do you mean by "stock Android"?

> Stock ROMs are not deGoogled, they are modified further by the manufacturer.

...(truncated)

GhostSplinterSix: I guess you've never heard of #grapheneos-offtopic:matrix.org

<anupritaisno1[m] "GhostSplinterSix: I guess you've"> Okay. And?

'stock' refers to it being the OS shipping on the device and that's never just AOSP

the OS they're starting from does not have Play services or customized support for their device

so at a minimum they're usually adding Google's unbundled Play services / app integration

which overrides a bunch of resources, replaces some AOSP components with Google ones, bundles assorted apps, sets up default / privileged permissions for them, etc.

that's only part of the difference from AOSP -> stock OS on Pixels

they start from AOSP

they use the AOSP source tree, and add repos to it

they don't change the AOSP repos, but rather add more repos, in some cases set up to override components, etc.

low-level OS is the same

certain app-based components, resources, properties, etc. are overridden

Sorry maybe I shouldve sent that in the off topic one lol

I was wrong to say stock. I think i meant the os on the pixel phones which are owned by Google and i guess it makes sense now.

Sorry for the confusion and thank you strcat for the details!

<s​ilentsolutions> does factory reset via settings menu also completely wipe the titan m?

yes

other than the frp data which we don't use